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  • Betrifft

    Handsome just for males

    Kommentar
    Hi everyone,

    I watched yesterday a movie in English and I heard a girl use the word "handsome" for a man. I thought about it for a little while and I think I never heard it to be addressed to a female. As I am from Germany and I´ve unfortunately not been in a English speaking country for a long period, I´ve just wondering if "handsome" is only used on males. This question is only meant if handsome is used in a context of beeing attractive or cute.

    Thanks
    VerfasserOneEyeJack (DE)09 Jan. 07, 10:33
    Kommentar
    Nowadays "handsome" is used only for males. You may find it used for females in older texts. It think it was used for females up to about the middle of the nineteenth century, but that usage is now obsolete.
    #1VerfasserJoe W09 Jan. 07, 10:36
    Kommentar
    I will disagree slightly. Handsome is predominantly used for males, but also for females who are not pretty or beautiful in a traditional sense, who may even be somewhat masculine-looking, but who are still attractive - haben das gewisse etwas (I only heard someone say this about a female colleague last week, and yes, she is handsome but not pretty!!)
    #2VerfasserMM-UK09 Jan. 07, 10:40
    Kommentar
    Interesting! I suppose that makes it almost but not quite obsolete, doesn't it?
    #3VerfasserJoe W09 Jan. 07, 10:51
    Kommentar
    @Joe
    P.S. The colleague speaking is somewhat older - but not quite middle of nineteenth century old!!
    #4VerfasserMM-UK09 Jan. 07, 10:56
    Kommentar
    Thanks for helping. I guess, I erase "handsome" out of my vocabulary for girls to make sure I do not put my foot in my mouth ;)
    #5VerfasserOneEyeJack (DE)09 Jan. 07, 11:08
    Kommentar
    I agree with MM. The term can be used for women, but perhaps some English-speaking women on LEO should inform us as to whether they would be offended if described as "handsome." I know that I have used this word to describe one of my female cousins, but I am not sure that I would use the term when speaking to her. To me, describing a woman as handsome means that she has an attractive appearance that conveys strength rather than delicacy.
    #6Verfasser Sharper (238296) 09 Jan. 07, 23:16
    Kommentar
    It occurred to me that in "Que sera sera" sung by Doris Day (rather attractive a woman, then) you hear "... will I be handsome, will I be rich? ..."
    Joe, are you sure about the nineteenth century? The song must be from (roughly) 1950, the middle of the twentieth century.

    And I've also heard "a handsome amount of money", which can be quite attractive as well, but hardly in the sexual meaning of the word :) How does it fit in the picture?
    #7Verfasser Chiron (241283) 10 Jan. 07, 11:50
    Kommentar
    OT, Sharper, re. "describing a woman as handsome means that she has an attractive appearance that conveys strength rather than delicacy" - sounds good to me! I'd prefer that over "delicate" any day.
    #8Verfassertanja110 Jan. 07, 12:23
    Kommentar
    Ich kannte "Que sera sera" nur mit "will I be pretty", nicht "handsome".
    Jetzt habe ich mal gegoogelt, und es scheint beide Versionen zu geben. Interessant...
    #9VerfasserSunny10 Jan. 07, 12:51
    Kommentar
    @Chiron: as far as I remember that song, in that verse the daughter was speculating over whether she might one day marry, and wondering about her possible future husband: "Will he be handsome? Will he be rich?" But I am open to correction.
    #10VerfasserJoe W10 Jan. 07, 12:53
    Kommentar
    Apologies! I have just checked http://www.lyriczz.com/lyriczz.php?songid=12960 and found:

    When I was just a little girl
    I asked my mother, what will I be
    Will I be pretty, will I be rich
    Here's what she said to me.

    Que Sera, Sera,
    Whatever will be, will be
    The future's not ours, to see
    Que Sera, Sera
    What will be, will be.

    When I was young, I fell in love
    I asked my sweetheart what lies ahead
    Will we have rainbows, day after day
    Here's what my sweetheart said.

    Que Sera, Sera,
    Whatever will be, will be
    The future's not ours, to see
    Que Sera, Sera
    What will be, will be.

    Now I have children of my own
    They ask their mother, what will I be
    Will I be handsome, will I be rich
    I tell them tenderly.

    Que Sera, Sera,
    Whatever will be, will be
    The future's not ours, to see
    Que Sera, Sera
    What will be, will be.


    So it is the singer's children (I would presume male) who ask "Will I be handsome?"
    #11VerfasserJoe W10 Jan. 07, 12:56
    Kommentar
    Handsome can also be used in a few other senses:

    A handsome salary

    A handsome reward

    A handsome palace

    A handsome horse
    #12VerfasserRobNYNY10 Jan. 07, 15:03
    Kommentar
    All right Joe, you win. Thanks for finally ridding me of a perplexity that has been long since gnawing my heels: I too had a vague inkling that 'handsome' would suit better a barbarian hero than the pretty and delicate girl he rescues, but was too much of a coward to ask directly...
    #13Verfasser Chiron (241283) 10 Jan. 07, 18:30
    Kommentar
    From my reading experiences, I have found "handsome" in connection only with "woman," never with "girl," which makes me think that only more mature women can be handsome.
    #14Verfasser dude (253248) 10 Jan. 07, 19:10
    Kommentar
    @ dude:
    I'd say you're probably right in most cases, but I do know of a counter-example. It's from a folk song called The Fair Maid and contains the line:
    "It's a pity we should lose you such a handsome young maid"

    Here's a link to the lyrics (I'd post but it's pretty long)...I can also see where this might be a unique case, if you read the rest of the song...
    http://www.sccs.swarthmore.edu/users/01/jet/l...
    #15VerfasserHanna <AE>10 Jan. 07, 19:23
    Kommentar
    @Hanna:
    Are you sure that maid is used in this song like girl and not like servant?

    Oops, just read the whole poem and now agree with you that this is a very special case and my earlier suggestion does not make much sense in this context. But I am tempted to defend it anyway :-)
    #16Verfasser AGB (236120) 10 Jan. 07, 21:41
    Kommentar
    I just watched a movie and young woman asked a man, if he doesnt think she is pretty.
    Then the man answers: oh no, obviously, you're handsome.
    and she responds: you only call old ladies handsome!

    so, i guess its right: "handsome" is used only for old women and males. (or maybe young women who are not actually pretty, but still they've got sth like mm-uk said)

    but now i wonder what do you say to a woman if you want to tell she is handsome (like really pretty) without using pretty ;)
    i mean there is a difference between handsome, pretty, beautiful...i want to say "handsome" without being rude, cause of the nowadays usage.
    #17Verfasserzerb01 Feb. 08, 17:42
    Kommentar
    I'll tell me Ma:

    I'll tell me ma when I go home
    The boys won't leave the girls alone
    They pulled my hair and they stole my comb
    But that's alright 'til I go home.

    She is handsome she is pretty
    She is the belle of Belfast City
    She is courting 1, 2, 3,
    Please won't you tell me who is she?
    #18Verfasser Werner (236488) 01 Feb. 08, 17:56
    Kommentar
    "now i wonder what do you say to a woman if you want to tell she is handsome (like really pretty) without using pretty ;)"

    How about "attractive"? :-)
    #19Verfassereszett.de (374487) 01 Feb. 08, 17:57
    Kommentar
    beautiful, awesome ...
    #20VerfasserBacon [de] (264333) 01 Feb. 08, 18:00
    Kommentar
    or gorgeous. fine. lovely.

    as a side note, i would be mildly offended if someone referred to me as handsome... to be on the safe side, don't use it for a woman.
    #21Verfasseralex03 Jun. 08, 08:30
    Kommentar
    I wouldn’t like to be referred to as handsome either.
    #22Verfasserbevalisch03 Jun. 08, 11:47
    Kommentar
    In my experience it is very common to refer to butch(er) women as handsome, whatever age they are. But maybe that's just within the LGBT community?
    #23Verfasserhelga_HH03 Jun. 08, 12:08
    Kommentar
    Calling a woman 'handsome' is damning her with faint praise!
    #24VerfasserMnz/a unpl03 Jun. 08, 12:40
    Kommentar
    24: Da fällt mir nun gar nichts zu ein. Oder so viel das es jeglichen Rahmen sprengen würde...
    #25Verfasserhelga_HH03 Jun. 08, 12:49
    Kommentar
    Weder MW noch AHD liefern ein Caveat zum Gebrauch bei Frauen.
    Allerdings finden ich die AHD-Defionition spannend:
    1. Pleasing and dignified in form or appearance. See synonyms at beautiful. 2. Generous or copious: a handsome reward. See synonyms at liberal. 3. Marked by or requiring skill dexterity: did some handsome maneuvers on the skating rink. 4. Appropriate or fitting: a handsome location for the new school. 5. Large: a handsome price; won by a handsome margin.

    Unter beautiful findet sich die Anmerkung:
    Handsome stresses poise and dignity of form and proportion
    #26VerfasserCJ unplugged03 Jun. 08, 12:56
    Kommentar
    @25: Was meinst Du damit?
    #27VerfasserMary nz/a (431018) 04 Jun. 08, 01:45
    Kommentar
    I agree with the people who said, a long time ago, that it was more typical in the 19th or earlier 20th century. It sort of reminds me of 'She's a fine figure of a woman.' To my ears it does have a slight tinge of faint praise. In novels, when it's said by smaller, meeker men, I feel like there's often an undertone of fear, implying that the woman was someone who could compete with or best men (which in those days was not a compliment, because it made men look henpecked in comparison). I'm thinking of, say, someone like Mark Twain or maybe even James Thurber.

    It's not often still used today. If it were it would probably still suggest a woman who was considerably taller, stronger, and more masculine-looking than average, but still not unattractive. I don't think it says anything about age per se. However, it is indeed in many ways the opposite of girlish, and traditionally, the archetype of feminine beauty has been pretty, delicate, girlish features.

    #28Verfasser hm -- us (236141) 04 Jun. 08, 02:15
    Kommentar
    @27
    I'm currently very annoyed with the dichotomy of women - feminine and man - masculine. There are so many people out there to which this doesn't apply. I don't feel qualified to go into a gender / gender expressions discussion, I just so often feel that we're so over all that stereotypical thinking that I hate my bubble to be burst by reality ;)

    So I guess I'll continue to call the handsome women in my life handsome and enjoy when they take it as the compliment it was meant to be.
    #29Verfasserhelga_HH 04 Jun. 08, 07:53
    Kommentar
    Hello,

    when I started learning English at school decades ago we learned a (U.S.?) song I still can remember at least in parts; maybe some of you also do, although I never heared it since.

    I know where I'm going
    and I know who's going with me.
    I know whom I love,
    but the devil knows whom I'll marry.

    I've stockings of silk,
    shoes of fine green leather,
    combs to buckle my hair
    and a ring for every finger.

    Some call him bad,
    others call him bonny,
    but for me he is
    my handsome, winsome Johnny.

    The singer is an 18th century upper-class young lady who fell in love with an outlaw.




    #30Verfasser Leseratz (238114) 05 Jun. 08, 17:52
    Kommentar
    OT:
    "damning her with faint praise!" - I love the handsomeness of this phrase. How is it expressed in German?
    #31Verfasseran American06 Jun. 08, 13:00
    Kommentar
    A letter from Monica Lewinsky (June 29, 1994) to Bill Clinton begins with "Dear Handsome".
    #32VerfasserHatsor17 Aug. 08, 12:31
    Kommentar
    @31: one could say: 'jemanden mit schwachem Lob strafen'
    #33Verfasserclara -de17 Aug. 08, 16:41
    Kommentar
    'Vanity Fair' about the New Yorker Morgans design-hotel: "The handsomest hotel in New York" (in 1983). Critics were impressed by the mix of strength and playfulness. Does that fit to a person -male of female- as well? Are these both attributes the main item of handsome?
    #34Verfasserclara -de17 Aug. 08, 17:09
    Kommentar
    Siehe auch: Siehe auch: handsome? Wie wird dieses Wort richtig interp...
    __________

    Bei Austen werden auch Frauen als handsome bezeichnet - und zwar in positivem Sinne.

    "I see no occasion for that. You and the girls may go, or you may send them by themselves, which perhaps will be still better, for as you are as handsome as any of them, Mr. Bingley may like you the best of the party."

    "I desire you will do no such thing. Lizzy is not a bit better than the others; and I am sure she is not half so handsome as Jane, nor half so good-humoured as Lydia. But you are always giving her the preference."

    "You are dancing with the only handsome girl in the room," said Mr. Darcy, looking at the eldest Miss Bennet.

    "she is tolerable, but not handsome enough to tempt me;"

    "But everybody is to judge for themselves, and the Lucases are a very good sort of girls, I assure you. It is a pity they are not handsome! Not that I think Charlotte so very plain—but then she is our particular friend."

    usw.


    Allerdings kann bei Austen vieles handsome sein: sogar ein Dinner :-)

    P&P, XXIX, "The dinner was exceedingly handsome"
    #35VerfasserLMH (469213) 04 Jan. 11, 15:29
    Kommentar
    **To English language learners**

    1.) Use "handsome" to describe men (and be careful if you yourself are male)
    2.) Use "beautiful" (NOT handsome) to describe a woman.

    To the native English commenters on here who are suggesting that "handsome" is a perfectly appropriate word to call a woman, to her face, you know what you are saying is wrong. Finding a strange exception here or there (especially in a book from the 19th century) is irresponsible and misleading to people who are trying to understand how to use this word today.

    An English-language learner is already vulnerable and likely to make embarrassing mistakes. Inviting them to use "handsome" in highly poetic if not downright outmoded ways, especially in an everyday context, is to invite them to make fools of themselves. Your job is to describe to them how English is actually used and spoken, not how you would like English to be used and spoken due to some political and/or sentimental reasons of your own.

    Finally, if you are speaking to advanced, very advanced learners, who are curious about the finer nuances of a word like "handsome" (e.g. to describe the grande dame type from the British commenter's office), then you should make clear that this is a poetic usage and not a standard usage. In standard, spoken English, "handsome" describes masculine, physical attractiveness.
    #36VerfasserBartholomew (611977) 19 Nov. 15, 15:28
     
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