I'd say it's "apprentice" you're looking for. A trainee can be anyone who does some sort of training. An apprenticeship always has some sort of fixed time-frame, whereas a trainee can be someone who comes in for a day and the next day is already a full-fledged member of the working staff (i.e. McJobs).

Meiner Ansicht nach:
apprentice = Azubi, Lehrling
trainee = Praktikant oder Hochschulabsolvent, der in einem Unternehmen ausgebildet wird. Es gibt in D viele Firmen, die für Hochschulabsolventen Trainee-Programme anbieten, häufig für ein Jahr, manchmal kürzer (6-10 Monate), manchmal länger (1,5 Jahre, 2 Jahre...); sicherlich zählt ein BA-Student auch dazu.

If you are learning about the job whilst being employed to do it you are a trainee. An apprentice is a particular type of trainee.

An apprentice serves an agreed time learning a skill bound by contract to a master craftsman, for example, during which he (very rarely she) learns the trade and receives a very low rate of pay.

I expect that if you search the web for "apprentice" and/or "apprenticeship" you will find out more about such schemes.

I agree with HerrRossi that apprentice is more suitable here, but you should make it clear that is regarding business-type training (I can't think of a nice word for this off the top of my head, Leo suggests commercial). Although it says in the online dictionary it can be for business, I think most people would automatically associate apprentices with 'trade', e.g.plumbing.

from http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=appr...
1. One bound by legal agreement to work for another for a specific amount of time in return for instruction in a trade, art, or business.
2. One who is learning a trade or occupation, especially as a member of a labor union.

how about apprentice clerk ??
I would associate clerk with commerce.

apprentice is definetely the equivalent you search for "kaufmaennische Auszubildende"

An apprentice is in Germany somebody who has regularly finished school and ongoes the first training on a chosen job in a certain enterprise. This takes usually three years. the apprentice works in this time for example 4 days a weak directly for the enterprise and spends an additional day in a special business-close school to be trained in backround knowledge.

A trainee is somebody who has earlier passed a special formation for the job he is now working in. Mostly he has already or nearly finished his studies at university. He is under contract in an enterprise for one or two years - while this period he is kind of a "test person" who will be eventually given a fixed contract as a "normal employee" after his trainee years or sometimes even earlier.
hope this helps and is understandable

@ Löwe

da du das angesprochen hast...ich hätte BAler jetzt eher unter apprentice eingeordnet, da sich die praktischen Ausbilungsinhalte in der Firma doch eher denen für die Lehrlinge/Azubis decken. Hab selber BA gemacht und viele von meinen Leuten im Kurs haben das gemacht, was auch die Azubis gemacht haben, bzw. wenn sie übernommen wurden, kamen sie hinterher meistens in ein Trainee-Programm.

Ich glaube, das Problem ist, daß "apprentice" eher verstanden wird wie "Lehrling", also jemand, der eine (m.W. meist drei Jahre dauernde) Ausbildung in einem Handwerk erhält, sei es als Schlosser/in oder als Schneider/in (JoeW, welcome to the 21st century! Depending on the specific trade, you might find quite a few "shes"). Umgekehrt wird der Begriff "trainee" in Deutschland oft für Hochschulabsolventen verwendet, die also schon eine fachspezifische Ausbildung, etwa ein BWL-Studium, hinter sich haben und nun die job- und unternehmensspezifischen Dinge lernen, üblich dürfte hier ein Zeitrahmen von bis zu einem Jahr sein. Darum klingt für den kaufmännischen Bereich das eine Wort für Engländer unpassend, das andere für Deutsche. Ein spezielles Wort für "Auszubildender" im weiteren Sinn, anders als apprentice/trainee, kenne ich leider auch nicht.
Vielleicht kann man sich mit einem angehängten "-in-training" behelfen? Also z.B. "sales assistant-in-training"? Would that be a good compromise, dear English native speakers? Would this sound better to you than "apprentice" or "trainee"?

@ julia

nachdem ich deinen Kommentar gelesen habe, muss ich sagen, dass du sicherlich recht hast, BAler eher bei apprentices einzuordnen. :)

just to put things back on line.

an apprentice - this is not a term that can be bandied about, and used for those purposes the user sees fit. it has two elements to it - the original meaning, and the modern reception of it, and these are not exactly synonymous.

the modern reception of the word has the inference, that what is being learned is a trade or occupation - mostly in the fields of what the Germans call Handwerk

so using the term apprentice in English (BE at least) will awaken associations with carpenters, plumbers, painters and the like.

the closest in German to this is Lehrling, but specially in a Handwerk.
it is *not* an Azubi, since Azubis can be receiving their training in just about any job at all, and not just in those fields normally associated with apprenticeships.

a trainee *might* often be used to refer to a Praktikant or Hochschulabsolvent, but what of 'Trainee Nurse', for example, where the above are not meant?

a trainee salesman
a trainee clerk

the word trainee is used for anyone getting on the job training in an occupation *not* normally covered by the traditional apprenticeship. to equate 'trainee' with somebody having a 'BA' is to give a distorted picture of who a trainee is

@ odondon girl

schön und gut, aber im Deutschen sind die Ausdrücke Lehrling und Azubi gleichgestellt. Denn eigentlich ist Lehrling nichts anderes als das veraltete Wort für Auszubildender. Man sagt nicht, ein Handwerker sei Lehrling und ein Büromensch Azubi. Beides sind Azubis. Früher waren beide Lehrlinge.

Now that's interesting since I have to struggle with similar problems in my company now & then.

@ odondon irl: what would you call a 'Praktikant' and a 'Studentische Aushilfe' or 'Werkstudent' then in BE? Our students do more admin jobs, so I just decided to call them 'Admin Support P/T'. Would that be OK? But what about 'Praktikanten'? Not always they are to stay in the company as, say (in our case), negotiator or consultant and I am not sure if 'trainee' fits then. What about 'internee' (if this is the term for someone doing an 'internship')?

Außerdem stimme ich Löwe zu, was seine Anmerkung zur vermeintlichen Unterscheidung zwischen Azubi und Lehrling angeht.

Ach, und >Korinthenkackmodus ein< Joe W: In Deutschland zumindest gehört z.B. Friseur(in) auch zu den Handwerksberufen, die überwiegend von Frauen ausgeübt werden, nur um ein Beispiel dafür zu nennen, dass 'very rarely a she' so nicht stimmen kann. >Korinthenkackmodus aus<. Ich nehme aber mal an, dass das mit 'very rarely' gemeint war. :-) Allerdings gehen mittlerweile auch immer mehr Frauen Handwerksberufen nach, v.a. wenn diese im kreativen Bereich liegen.
Aber das nur am Rande.

@Löwe - I'm quite aware of the non-distinction in German, but the major differences in how Germans and BEs see the world of people learning a job makes any form of translation almost impossible -we can only try to get 'close' to what one term in German means in English.

an apprentice clerk in BE would sound very, very strange indeed, since 'apprentice' is only commonly associated with the classical trades.
the fact that in Germany almost any job can have a 'Lehrzeit' raises more than just eyebrows in the BE-world (I'm emphasising the BE-bit here, since I can't speak for the AE situation...)

I've written this before, but for the sake of clarity, here it is again - even the idea of a young person being required to do three years of training in order to become a sales assistant in a bakery is ridiculous for BE-natives, but quite normal for Germans.

@pia - I'd say you have to be inventive - the concepts involved here on the German side, are, as far as my experience goes, unknown in BE parts of the world - I mean the putting into 'boxes' of temporary employees according to the special programs used to get them on board - Werksstudent, Praktikant, studentische Aushilfe - for Praktikant I'd say - someone getting on-the-job experience; for studentische Aushilfe I'd say - hired help (the fact that they are a student is irrelevant in a work context in GB/IRL, according to my experience)

@Pia
I think Praktikant can correspond to internee and I would say that's a real word! However, if the Praktikum is very short term, then 'work-experience student' can be used instead. I have had this dicussion with friends in England beofre, as I myself did a Praktikum in Germany, however it is less common (or possibly none existant) in England, so it is more difficult to explain, there is no nice corresponding English word. Internee and wrok experience student work quite well, but would ususally equire a little explanation of exactly what was involved too. For example, a work experience can be a week, when you are about 16, or a couple if months in the summer, whilst a university student.

@ odonon irl
You posted your lat item whilst I was writing mine, but I fully agree with you, the whole concept of Pratikum, Werkstudent and three years training to become a sales assistant in a bakery is a perfect example of the cultural differences reagarding qualifications.
Another one is the whole Backerei/Konditerei difference - in England a baker can make both bread and cakes!

@ odondon irl & joe: Thank you very much to you both. Just one last question joe: What would you call a 'very short term Praktikum'? Is 6 months short-term in your opinion?

In AE we say Intern, not Internee.

I interned at an engineering firm for a full year while in my last year of university, and got paid $35,000 to do it.
The company also had Co-ops, who spent 4 6-month periods at the company (In my mind, a co-op gets college credit for working a job, usually for less money.)

@MRE - thanks for the AE input!

Heißt es nicht auch 'interns' in BE? Internee würde ich mit 'Internierter' übersetzen.

@pia
sorry for delay, actually been doing some work for once!
No, in English standards, 6 months is a long praktikum. Short is a couple of weeks. It is common for school aged children (around 16) to do a one week work experience and many legal firms offer 1 or 2 week work experience placements for university students.
That is a better word for something longer (I just came across it without even thinking about it) placement. Some courses at university entail a 6 month or one year 'placement' with a firm.

Makes sense. Many thanks joe.

I am not sure about this, but as far as I understand it, a "Werkstudent" is someone who works part-time during his/her studies in an area that is relevant to the subject he/she is studying. In the case of a "studentische Aushilfe", the degree subject is less important, as the work is less a contribution to the student's education and more like cheap labour for routine office tasks. I don't think either of these concepts exist in the UK. One often sees "student jobs" advertised - these tend to be part-time jobs for students and can include things like waiting tables.

A "Praktikant", on the other hand, appears to be someone who interrupts his/her studies to get some work experience, or does this during university vacations, or just after finishing his/her degree. In a BE context, I would definitely translate this as an 'intern' (though mre's comment suggests that in America, an internship can be done part-time while studying). Many university students in Britain do summer internships, usually before their last year of university. These internships can last from a couple of weeks to three months. Many companies recruit (some of) their management trainees from the ranks of their summer interns.

Another thing to remember is that in the UK (and the USA), the subject someone studied at university is much less important than in Germany. It is perfectly normal for a history graduate, for example, to get a job as a management trainee. In Germany, only business graduates would usually receive that sort of job (though this appears to be changing slowly, especially in international companies - an example is the McKinsey advertisement on the LEO website).

As for 'apprentice', I agree 100% with odondon irl.

Kleine Bemerkung am Rande: in Österreich gibt es keine Azubis, sondern nur Lehrlinge. Dort ist der Begriff also keineswegs veraltet. (Ähnlich wie die 'Volksschule'.)

@ Claire

Das unterstreicht doch nur die Bemerkung, dass Azubis von der Bedeutung her mit Lehrlingen gleichzustellen sind.
Andererseits gibt es bei euch Öschis ja auch gespritzten Apfelsaft, was bei uns eine völlig andere Bedeutung hat.

When I read odondon irl's comments about clerk vs. apprentice I agreed totally and was ashamed that I'd offered apprentice clerk. Of course I would say trainee clerk, so why did I think apprentice clerk. Then I googled both - and now I know why. I have an older friend who was an apprentice clerk in the RAF, but it was some time ago (he is now 72). And the google hits for apprentice clerk (at least on the first couple of pages) all seem pretty ancient. There is not much difference in the number of hits though.
However, I agree that trainee clerk is definitely correct.

@Löwe

Ich widerspreche dir ja gar nicht :-) Du hast Recht: im deutschsprachigen Raum wird kein Unterschied zwischen handwerklichen Berufen, kaufmännischen Berufen, usw gemacht - alle sind Lehrlinge bzw. Azubis.

Ich wollte nur der Vollständigkeit und der allgemeinen Völkerverständigung zuliebe erwähnen, dass in diesem Fall ein kleiner Sprachunterschied besteht. Kommt ja nicht selten in diesem Forum vor, dass einem armen Österreicher gesagt wird "Dieses Wort gibt es nicht; nie gehört" oder "Weißt du denn nicht, dass es schon seit Jahren keine Volksschule mehr gibt?", oder ähnliches. Da fühle ich mich als Teil-Österreicherin verpflichtet, präventiv vorzubeugen :-)

@ Claire

Oh, es lag mir fern, auch dir zu widersprechen.
Dass die Österreicher viele Wörter benützen und auch manche Wörter anders benützen, sei es mit anderer Bedeutung oder sei es, dass sie es bei den Deutschen eigentlich nicht mehr gibt ist mir als Süddeutscher durchaus bekannt. Das gleiche gilt ja sogar innerhalb eines Landes.
Ich finde es interessant, wenn auch die Österreicher, Schweizer usw. ihr Schärflein beitragen.
:-)