Hi hm--us

I still do when I'm feeling pedantic, because I do know the difference :-)

Seriously though, I would use this form in only very few circumstances, e.g. replying to a formal invitation couched in similar terms, which to be honest don't arise very often. I rarely use it in writng reports/articles.

Yes, it's dated, and no, I wouldn't teach it to German speakers these days.

The only one of your examples which does spring naturally to my lips is "I should think ..."

e.g.
"Mum, can you run me to school on Thursday because I've got so much stuff to take?
"Yes, I should think so."

Put me down as a more traditional speaker ...

I agree with Marianne. I'm not a native speaker but I live with one (English), and the only one we use is 'I should think so' or 'I should (certainly) hope so' (the latter usually in a slightly indignant tone of voice), but neither of them very often.

Thanks, you two. (-:

I did find a few more scraps in the archive,

related discussion: I would like to vs. I should like to
related discussion: shall, should and would
related discussion: shall - should
Suche in allen Foren: shall+will


but I'm not sure we've ever actually surveyed BE speakers, so I'll be interested to hear other reactions too.

I'm hoping it will also be interesting to German speakers who still run across this in textbooks. As a side question, I'd be curious to know how common that is.

hm_us, I use "I should think so/I should (certainly) hope so," too, and have heard other Americans use these phrases. But, I/they've use them when emphasizing something just said.

I agree with Marianne & co. I probably use "should" more frequently in set phrases, perhaps more frequently in the negative: "I shouldn't think so" (tentatave) or "I should hope not" (emphatic)".

I might even say "I shouldn't do that if I were you".

Regarding your textbook question: In the grammar book that we used at school (Lower Saxony) at the beginning of the 90s, this first person use of shall and should was not covered anymore. But remember that I once came accross a grammar book from about 1980 that included this topic.

BTW: I had a rather serious misunderstanding with my boss (who is 60 years old) two weeks ago because he used "should" where I'd have used "would" and I got a completely wrong idea of what he wanted to say. So it's sometimes important to be aware of this dying part of English grammar.

I'm also in the 60+ category and when I'm in 'pedant' mode (writing formal letters or reports) I would usually use should where it's appropriate.

I must admit, though, after living in Germany for twenty years, I'm probably not as consistent in my usage as I used to be, or ought to be!

I'm thirty-something, and slightly conservative in my usage, but I'm nevertheless in broad agreement with everyone else. "I should think so" and "I should hope so" are part of my vocabulary, but mostly I
I would prefer, even in these cases, to use would, since should tends to sound rather stuffy. In writing business letters, I might go for "We should be obliged... ", but only if a very formal tone seems appropriate.

I wouldn't teach non-natives to use "should" like this, but they probably ought to be made aware of it at some point.

Thank you very much, everyone. (-:

I'm still wondering how many German speakers still see sentences like 'I should prefer' or 'We should be obliged' in textbooks.

hm - us, I attended a German language school, which used BE textbooks, and I'm fairly sure that "We should be obliged..." sentence structure was taught in business correspondence. Am in the process of moving, all books packed, but will check sometime next week and let you know.

Here is one German and Denglisch speaker who still reads and hears the above discussed expressions, especially in contact to English and Irish colleagues (older and younger ones). What´s to find in textbooks I don´t know. But I remember to have learned it in school at least as a side note in higher senior years (I´m thirty-something).

I think I´m aware of the implicated differences of meaning. And I find the usage quite nice, but I´m sometimes rather traditional concerning language use (but certainly am not a linguistics scientist or other professional). But this is may-be comparable to all the stuff around Konjunktiv and starke Beugung, Optativ, Kondizional, etc. in German or other languages (like Italian) which I like and wish to be preserved of beeing washed away from TV-small talk and soap opera life style ;-) ..... it makes life and language in a kind more colourful and fascinating. But may-be that´s my opinion, because I´m not very afraid and ashamed of making mistakes and therefor(e) to be laughed about ....