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    Wrong entry in LEO?

    epicaricacy - die Schadenfreude

    12­ Replies
    Wrong entry

    epicaricacy - die Schadenfreude

    Comment
    It seems the "resume discussion" feature doesn't work. The old discussion can be found here: related discussion

    A friendly person, Ken Spector, sent me an email with additional information about "epicaricacy" after having noticed the discussion in the LEO forum:


    You folks have discussed the word 'epicaricacy', at these two spots on the web:
      related discussion:epicaricacy - schadenfreude 
    http://www.hintonnews.net/local/hinchen23.html
     
    One of the comments was, "I almost suspect this word was coined/invented recently." I can give you some more data.
     
    The word appears in most of the editions of Nathaniel Bailey's dictionary. Bailey's dictionary was highly respected, was published and republished for about 50 years starting in 1721, and was Samuel Johnson's basic word-list from which he prepared his dictionary, acknowledged to be the master.
     
    Linguist Joseph T. Shipley included it in his Dictionary of Early English (1963), citing Bailey.
     
    Our bulletin board has discussed this repeatedly over many months, as new information is found. You'll find the most recent discussion here: http://wordcraft.infopop.cc/eve/ubb.x?a=tpc&s....
     
    The word is not OED as listed term being defined -- but it is in one of there sample quotes for another word. Here's their first quotation for 'shadenfeude', from 1852; the citation also uses 'epicaricacy', spelling it in greek letters.

    1852 R. C. TRENCH Study of Words (ed. 3) II. 29 What a fearful thing is it that any language should have a word expressive of the pleasure which men feel at the calamities of others; for the existence of the word bears testimony to the existence of the thing. And yet in more than one such a word is found... In the Greek έπιχαρεκακία, in the German, ‘Schadenfreude’.
    AuthorNorbert Juffa31 May 05, 07:21
    Comment
    I had previously promised to provide the entry for 'epicaricacy' from "Mrs. Byrne's Dictionary". Here it is. Unfortunately, no specific source is given.

    Josefa A Heifetz Byrne, "Mrs. Byrne's Dictionary of Unusual, Obscure, and Preposterous Words" (New and Revised Edition, 1994):

    epicaricacy n.
    taking pleasure in others' misfortune.
    #1AuthorNorbert Juffa31 May 05, 07:27
    Comment
    So what would you suggest for German?
    #2AuthorMondschaf27 Jun 10, 20:14
    Suggestions

    schadenfreudy (seldom)

    -

    Schadenfreude



    Context/ examples

    1 - In German, Schadenfreude is always capitalized. However, when used as a loanword in English, it is usually not. The corresponding German adjective is schadenfroh, sometimes anglicized as schadenfreudy.

    2 - The word derives from Schaden (damage, harm) and Freude (joy); Schaden derives from the Middle High German schade, from the Old High German scado. Freude comes from the Middle High German vreude, from the Old High German frewida, from frō, (happy). In German, the word always has a negative connotation. A distinction exists between "secret schadenfreude" (a private feeling) and "open schadenfreude" (Hohn, a German word roughly translated as "scorn") which is outright public derision.

    3 - Little-used English words synonymous with schadenfreude have been derived from the Greek word ἐπιχαιρεκακία.[3][4] Nathan Bailey's 18th-century Universal Etymological English Dictionary, for example, contains an entry for epicharikaky that gives its etymology as a compound of epi (upon), chaira (joy), and kakon (evil).[5][6] A popular modern collection of rare words, however, gives its spelling as "epicaricacy." [7]

    4 - A more common English expression with a similar meaning is 'Roman holiday', a metaphor taken from the poem "Childe Harold's Pilgrimage" by George Gordon, Lord Byron, where a gladiator in Ancient Rome expects to be "butcher'd to make a Roman holiday" while the audience would take pleasure from watching his suffering. The term suggests debauchery and disorder in addition to sadistic enjoyment.[8]

    5 - Another phrase with a meaning similar to Schadenfreude is "morose delectation" ("delectatio morosa" in Latin), meaning "the habit of dwelling with enjoyment on evil thoughts".[9] The medieval church taught morose delectation as a sin.[10][11] French writer Pierre Klossowski (1905-2001) maintained that the appeal of sadism is morose delectation.[12][13]

    http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/epi...

    Comment
    also: 2 - 5
    #3Authorw27 Jun 10, 21:02
    Comment
    @w: Du solltest deine eigenen Zitate genauer lesen, dann würdest du nicht ein englisches Adjektiv mit einem deutschen Substantiv koppeln wollen!
    #4AuthorMondschaf27 Jun 10, 22:24
    Context/ examples
    Usage notes
    The word is mentioned in some early dictionaries, but there is little or no evidence of actual usage until it was picked up by various "interesting word" websites around the turn of the twenty-first century.
    http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/epicaricacy
    #5AuthorMondschaf27 Jun 10, 23:54
    Comment
    I suspect that any adjective would probably need to be hyphenated to show that it's not a serious or standard word in English:

    schadenfreud-y [hum.] - schadenfroh (adj.)

    In general, it would be a big mistake to add anything on the sole recommendation of some commercial site such as freedictionary.com, which doesn't have any particular authority or reliability.

    If I felt like taking the time, I might actually want to question the existing entry

    mischievousness = die Schadenfreude;

    I don't quite see how that fits.

    #6Authorhm -- us (236141) 28 Jun 10, 03:09
    Comment
    Schaden + FreudE = damage + joY

    Sometimes clumsily anglicized: schadenfreudy
    #7Authorw28 Jun 10, 11:15
    Comment
    >>The corresponding German adjective

    [zu mir] Oh God, am I starting to have conversations like w consisting of nothing but quotations ... [/zu mir]
    #8Authorhm -- us (236141) 28 Jun 10, 18:16
    Context/ examples

    epicaricacy

    Noun (uncountable)

    (rare) Rejoicing at or derivation of pleasure from the misfortunes of others.

    Usage notes

    The word is mentioned in some early dictionaries, but there is little or no evidence of actual usage until it was picked up by various "interesting word" websites around the turn of the twenty-first century.

    https://www.yourdictionary.com/epicaricacy (meine Hervorh.)


    One can almost detect an element of epicaricacy from the Brexit-supporting English, who have been the objects of scorn from the Scottish intelligentsia during the long debate in respect of Brexit.

    https://www.nysun.com/foreign/in-just-a-wee-b...


    “The Act was passed to keep us in our place. What joy if its first and preferably only use were to wipe the smiles presently glued to Labor faces.” Despite the opportunity for epic epicaricacy, though, this option may well prove prohibitively provocative.

    https://www.nysun.com/foreign/brexit-what-wou...


    Tony Blair must be enjoying a moment of epicaricacy over Donorgate and Gordon Brown being described by David Cameron in PMQs as 'the man in the canoe'.

    https://www.law.com/international-edition/200...


    Hours after senior Congress leader Shashi Tharoor dismissed the charges of abetment to suicide in connection with the death of his wife Sunanda Pushkar on Monday, the MP from Thiruvananthapuram decided to take a break from Twitter, while saying that “one encounters too much epicaricacy” on it.

    https://www.thestatesman.com/india/epicaricac...


    Do non-Europeans want the Brits to leave the EU due to epicaricacy, or do they genuinely think this will be good for Britain?

    https://www.quora.com/Do-non-Europeans-want-t...


    And yes, the Times may just be engaging in epicaricacy, but that should not compel us to give ourselves over to cacozelia. Surely not.

    https://www.nationalreview.com/corner/decline...


    the mistaken belief that there is no English equivalent for a non-English word, such as Schadenfreude, which many people believe doesn’t translate, but which of course simply means epicaricacy.

    https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2014...


    His club make no apologies for having ambition, and nor should they, but a degree of epicaricacy (the English word for Schadenfreude, don't let anyone tell you there isn't one) when things go wrong comes with the territory.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/ar...


    Comment


    Nach Jahrhunderten(?) beständiger Hinweise, dass das Wort "epicaricacy" zwar in einzelnen Nachschlagewerken vorkomme, aber fast gänzlich ungebräuchlich sei (e.g. Siehe auch: epicaricacy), scheinen stetes Dementi und Onlineverbreitung in den letzten Jahren zu zu einer merklichen Gebrauchsbelebung geführt zu haben:

    Vgl. https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content...

    #9Authorlingua franca (48253)  03 Oct 20, 17:03
    Comment

    Ngram Viewer

    S/schadenfreude 1688

    epicaricacy        15

    #10Authormanni3 (305129)  03 Oct 20, 19:54
    Comment

    Jetzt bin ich aber schwer enttäuscht, dass die moralische Überlegenheit der englischen Muttersprachler doch nicht so einfach zu belegen ist, wie es jemand im deutschen Radio vor ein paar Tagen behauptete. In deutschen Medien wird aktuell immer wieder mal diskutiert, ob man wegen Trumps Infektion mit Covid-19 Schadenfreude empfinden dürfe. Das Ergebnis ist üblicherweise, dass man sich zu solch niederen Instinkten nicht herablassen solle, aber der eine oder andere gab doch zu, dass er diese Reaktion nicht komplett vermeiden konnte. In dem Zusammenhang hat jemand (ich weiß leider nicht mehr, wer das war und wo es zu hören war) allen Ernstes behauptet, dass es in der englischen Sprache deswegen kein Wort für Schadenfreude gäbe, weil dieses Gefühl Amerikanern und Engländern von Natur aus völlig fremd wäre. In diesen Ländern käme Schadenfreude praktisch nicht vor. Ich hatte und habe an dieser Erklärung leichte Zweifel.

    #11Authorharambee (91833) 04 Oct 20, 15:36
    Comment

    #11 - In dem Zusammenhang hat jemand (ich weiß leider nicht mehr, wer das war und wo es zu hören war) allen Ernstes behauptet, dass es in der englischen Sprache deswegen kein Wort für Schadenfreude gäbe, weil dieses Gefühl Amerikanern und Engländern von Natur aus völlig fremd wäre.


    How absolutely ridiculous. They can't have been serious?!

    #12Authorcovellite (520987) 06 Oct 20, 15:02
     
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